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Forum Discussion
Concerns About 1P 8 for Mac from a Web and Software Developer
So I briefly tried 1P 8 and then noped right back to 1P 7. Here are some of my concerns, I hope they are fixed before general public release:
- Mini. This is how I use 1P daily. Seems that 1P Mini has been reduced to a search field. Fine, I guess. May be nice. But that I cannot change its keyboard shortcut. I mean, with 1P 7 I use a 2-key shortcut that is deeply engrained in my memory and prime at my keyboard alongside other key system shortcuts. You have to allow us to "import" that into 1P 8. Such customizations is critical on macOS. Also, does Mini require the menubar option be shown? Why is that? I don't show 1P 7 there because the keyboard shortcut is all I need on my desktop with 2 large displays. All that considered, it was in my testing nearly impossible to just bring up Mini from any app.
- Safari. Why require a separate app again, like was needed in the past and for Chrome? And it seems that it was not sensitive to showing logins for sites I am on like all 1P versions of the past did. Why? Will this be fixed? While the search is great for straight-up use, 1P in browser must be able to surface what it thinks will be needed most. Does it, too, need to be in the (about to be ever weirder, thanks Apple, but that is another issue not for you all) status bar? Because I also don't show it in 1P 7 given the keyboard being how I invoke 1P.
- Biometry. I use my Apple Watch multiple times a day to unlock 1P. In 1P 8 Mini the main 1P window always had to come up, and then me click a button, to trigger it. In 1P 7 Mini it just initiates the biometry itself. Why is this so much more user-intensive now? This, too, must be just as simple as it is today. Unlocking the main window was equally button-heavy. This is just untenably annoying.
- Electron. I mean, really, maybe it can be made to look more like the existing macOS app and other Mac apps. But that is way too heavy for a password manager. Please reconsider and go back to Cocoa. Maybe I'm needlessly harsh on this point. But given my others, this is a compounded concern. I use VS Code almost daily. I've grown used to it. That is Electron. But one of the main reasons I use 1P is its nativeness. Regardless the tech underneath, 1P 8 does not feel native. This is a serious disappointment.
- Preferences. As I alluded to above, all existing 1P 7 preferences must be present in 1P 8. I have 1P set up how it works best for me. Not just keyboard shortcuts being all custom, but nearly every preference I likely have tweaked at one time or another. These must stay customizable. All of them.
I truly am sorry if this feels harsh. As 1P support staff may know, I post here often with questions and answers. I've used 1P since it used the Mac OS X keychain for storage and now use Families. I write software (web, iOS, Mac, etc.) and manage websites for organizations for a living, so have some idea of what feedback should be, but also how critical my password manager is in my line of work. It and its speed and stability are critical. 1P 8 truly saddens me and makes me wonder if my longtime support of you all was misplaced years ago until now.
I am more than willing to continue this conversation here or in another venue. But I will not be trying 1P 8 again until it is finalized. This is unlike me, as I have used 1P betas in the late-summers for years. Kind of feel it is a role I as another developer should play. By general public release, I sincerely hope for all of us that my concerns, and the many concerns expressed by others here, are taken seriously. Or that you do as Apple themselves are with iOS and keep 1P 7 fully supported and getting updates even after 1P 8 ships.
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52 Replies
roustem1Password Team
For me, 1Password serves as a store for "high priority" items I'm more likely to need regardless of what device I have on hand — key logins, software licenses, passport, etc while more pedestrian web account info is handled by iCloud Keychain. In my case the main app is the primary interface, so it's quite noticeable when random bits of jank, reduced smoothness in animation, alien widget behaviors, etc are introduced.
I agree about the high priority items and with the improvements in 1Password 8 I started using it for more documents and attachments. I even recently added my kid's report card to a vault because I know we will always be able to find it there and it is available to the entire family:
At the same time, at least in my experience, this is still less that 10% of what 1Password is used for day-todau: effortlessly signing into websites, filling credit cards, copying passwords.
Well, I use 1Pwd not only for web passwords. I use it for many other informations (notes, accounts, server, plan routers...). The app is the main tool to collect and update important infos & details
Indeed, use cases vary between users a fair bit I'd imagine.
For me, 1Password serves as a store for "high priority" items I'm more likely to need regardless of what device I have on hand — key logins, software licenses, passport, etc while more pedestrian web account info is handled by iCloud Keychain. In my case the main app is the primary interface, so it's quite noticeable when random bits of jank, reduced smoothness in animation, alien widget behaviors, etc are introduced.
I completely agree and it even came up in our internal discussions earlier today. Most of the time, the main 1Password app is closed or hidden, it is not something where we spend a lot of time. The 1Password mini (aka, Quick Access) and the browser extension are the two components used most often.
It would be helpful to get a roadmap or some examples of how Quick Access is intended to end up, because at the moment it's really lacking in functionality compared to 1Password Mini and this is one of my biggest issues with 1Password 8 currently. I use 1Password Mini as my main interaction point with 1Password - I rarely actually open the app. I do most of my editing in Mini, and currently that doesn't feel like a workflow that is allowed for with Quick Access.
I completely agree and it even came up in our internal discussions earlier today. Most of the time, the main 1Password app is closed or hidden, it is not something where we spend a lot of time. The 1Password mini (aka, Quick Access) and the browser extension are the two components used most often. <
Well, I use 1Pwd not only for web passwords. I use it for many other informations (notes, accounts, server, plan routers...). The app is the main tool to collect and update important infos & details.- roustem
Thank you for the great feedback, austin!
Resizing the font with ⌘+ and ⌘- is actually my favourite part, I am able to adjust how much information is shown on the screen. And so often we had older customers who wanted to see a bigger font.
I also love what you said here:
I’m sure I’m going to run into things that are going to annoy me more, but I want feature parity between 1Password CLI, 1Password for Mac, 1Password for Web, and if it takes a Rust backend with Electron to do that…so be it. But please don’t lose sight of the features that customers love. The less time I am in 1Password the application, the better, because then it’s doing its job and I just don’t have to think.
I completely agree and it even came up in our internal discussions earlier today. Most of the time, the main 1Password app is closed or hidden, it is not something where we spend a lot of time. The 1Password mini (aka, Quick Access) and the browser extension are the two components used most often.
@chadseld, so as you can maybe tell, I'm experimentally running 1P 8 now, with 1P 7 still installed but fully quit, which is where my greater feedback stems from. Another point that I believe is Electron-based, but maybe can be fixed: A lot of the time when opening the main app the "app menu" (the one that is the app name just right of the menu) is stuck highlighted until I click it open and closed. I think this is largely whenever I hide or quit the app using the keyboard shortcuts. Again, I'm guessing this is Electron weirdness (I think I've seen this before in Electron apps), but just calling attention to it. Hopefully it can be fixed. At any rate VS Code does not have the same issue.
@chadseld, you know, another point re my original comment on biometry especially regarding Quick Access: Not only does the main app window open to manually allow clicking the biometry button, which is annoying enough. It does a few other things that should be fixed:
- It stays open, instead of hiding again and revealing Quick Access. This is where it is a massive step back from Mini. Mini automatically initiates biometry, and does it all within itself, to leave the main app "closed" and take you where you want to be
- By using the main app, it puts 1P 8 in the "recently used" apps in the Dock. This is also annoying, and a reason to not require that the main app get invoked at all.
Another thing I realize Quick Access lacks: Generating passwords. I sometimes need passwords for things that are not in a web browser. For example, ssh key passphrase, GPG key passphrase, passwords for other apps, example strong passwords, etc. Mini gives easy access to the password generator for these uses. I can't seem to get to this in Quick Access, which seems designed only for retrieval, not as easily for creation.
Microsoft has got nothing on 1Password. We're clearly passionate about the changes here, but this is a silly comparison, like comparing 1Password and iCloud keychain.
Truth is, Microsoft has had a cloud-synced integrated password manager since Windows 8, when you started to be able to sign into Windows with a Microsoft Account. It ONLY works with Windows itself or Edge. Windows Store apps can integrate themselves into the manager as well, but those are very few and far between. Microsoft has started surfacing this password manager more by making it visible in the Microsoft Authenticator app, but there's no Mac or web version (yet).
1Password stores more than just simple passwords. It's also a OTP generator for example. You can assign multiple websites to a single entry for site recognition, something both Microsoft and Apple can't currently do. 1Password can store passports, driver's licences, and a whole bunch of other things that, sure, you COULD stick into a OneNote notebook, but it's nowhere near secure. This isn't a primary business for these companies, I doubt they will Sherlock 1Password's supported platform list of functionality any time soon.
Look, I joined this forum to bang the Electron Sucks drum.
PS, I don't know why people keep harping on "enterprise is driving these changes". Maybe that revenue is, but oh boy does the enterprise hate change more than all of you combined. Do you still need to encounter Windows XP in your day to day job? No? Well, I have clients who do.
Microsoft has got nothing on 1Password. We're clearly passionate about the changes here, but this is a silly comparison, like comparing 1Password and iCloud keychain.
Truth is, Microsoft has had a cloud-synced integrated password manager since Windows 8, when you started to be able to sign into Windows with a Microsoft Account. It ONLY works with Windows itself or Edge. Windows Store apps can integrate themselves into the manager as well, but those are very few and far between. Microsoft has started surfacing this password manager more by making it visible in the Microsoft Authenticator app, but there's no Mac or web version (yet).
1Password stores more than just simple passwords. It's also a OTP generator for example. You can assign multiple websites to a single entry for site recognition, something both Microsoft and Apple can't currently do. 1Password can store passports, driver's licences, and a whole bunch of other things that, sure, you COULD stick into a OneNote notebook, but it's nowhere near secure. This isn't a primary business for these companies, I doubt they will Sherlock 1Password's supported platform list of functionality any time soon.
Look, I joined this forum to bang the Electron Sucks drum. But Microsoft and Apple are not truly threatening competitors here. For once.
PS, I don't know why people keep harping on "enterprise is driving these changes". Maybe that revenue is really growing, but oh boy does the enterprise hate change more than all of you combined. Do you still need to encounter Windows XP in your day to day job? No? Well, I have clients who do. 🤦🏼♂️
