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nukmicah
Dedicated Contributor
3 years ago

1P8 Password Generator Strength Good versus Fantastic

1Password is using different meters for the Password Generator versus once they're made, which is confusing and annoying as I want all my passwords to be Fantastic as long as the site supports it. Pl...
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home","parent":{"__ref":"Category:category:discuss"},"ancestors":{"__typename":"CoreNodeConnection","edges":[{"__typename":"CoreNodeEdge","node":{"__ref":"Community:community:cuxzj43862"}},{"__typename":"CoreNodeEdge","node":{"__ref":"Category:category:discuss"}}]},"userContext":{"__typename":"NodeUserContext","canAddAttachments":false,"canUpdateNode":false,"canPostMessages":false,"isSubscribed":false},"theme":{"__ref":"Theme:customTheme1"},"boardPolicies":{"__typename":"BoardPolicies","canViewSpamDashBoard":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.access_spam_quarantine.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.access_spam_quarantine.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}},"canArchiveMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.content_archivals.enable_content_archival_settings.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.content_archivals.enable_content_archival_settings.accessDenied","args":[]}},"canPublishArticleOnCreate":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.forums.policy_can_publish_on_create_workflow_action.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.forums.policy_can_publish_on_create_workflow_action.accessDenied","args":[]}}},"linkProperties":{"__typename":"LinkProperties","isExternalLinkWarningEnabled":true}},"ForumTopicMessage:message:143839":{"__typename":"ForumTopicMessage","uid":143839,"subject":"1P8 Password Generator Strength Good versus Fantastic","id":"message:143839","entityType":"FORUM_TOPIC","eventPath":"category:discuss/community:cuxzj43862board:1password/message:143839","revisionNum":1,"repliesCount":17,"author":{"__ref":"User:user:15613"},"depth":0,"hasGivenKudo":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:1password"},"conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:143839"},"readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"showMoveIndicator":false,"moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:143839"},"body@stripHtml({\"truncateLength\":200})":" 1Password is using different meters for the Password Generator versus once they're made, which is confusing and annoying as I want all my passwords to be Fantastic as long as the site supports it. Pl...","body@stringLength":"2441","rawBody":"

1Password is using different meters for the Password Generator versus once they're made, which is confusing and annoying as I want all my passwords to be Fantastic as long as the site supports it. Please use the same meter for the generator that you're already using once they're made. I have the same issue on the Windows desktop app and Android. The strength meter is important to help users provide stronger passwords, as discussed in https://1password.community/discussion/19507/understanding-password-strength-meters and in https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/publication/does-my-password-go-up-to-eleven-the-impact-of-password-meters-on-password-selection/

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You can see here the strength meter is full green. I tested increasing characters to 100, and the strength bar stayed full green, no change.
\n

\n\n

However after the credential has been saved, 1Password tells me it's only Good, not Fantastic.
\n

\n\n

I'm confused why you have two different rating system UIs in the first place. Imo the generator should show exactly the same info as it'll show once saved, maybe like this:
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\n\n
\n\n

1Password Version: 8.8.0 / 8.9.2
\nExtension Version: Not Provided
\nOS Version: Win10 / Android 12
\nBrowser:_ Not Provided
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\n","kudosSumWeight":0,"postTime":"2022-08-27T08:40:21.000-07:00","images":{"__typename":"AssociatedImageConnection","edges":[{"__typename":"AssociatedImageEdge","cursor":"MjUuNHwyLjF8b3wyNXxfTlZffDE","node":{"__ref":"AssociatedImage:{\"url\":\"https://www.1password.community/t5/s/cuxzj43862/images/bS0xNDM4MzktNjk0M2kyNkY3ODlFNDQ2Q0IzMzM3?revision=1\"}"}},{"__typename":"AssociatedImageEdge","cursor":"MjUuNHwyLjF8b3wyNXxfTlZffDI","node":{"__ref":"AssociatedImage:{\"url\":\"https://www.1password.community/t5/s/cuxzj43862/images/bS0xNDM4MzktNjk0NGlCMzg2MUE3NDBDREFCMDA0?revision=1\"}"}},{"__typename":"AssociatedImageEdge","cursor":"MjUuNHwyLjF8b3wyNXxfTlZffDM","node":{"__ref":"AssociatedImage:{\"url\":\"https://www.1password.community/t5/s/cuxzj43862/images/bS0xNDM4MzktNjk0MWkyODIwQ0RBMjEwNzlDMEM4?revision=1\"}"}}],"totalCount":3,"pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null}},"attachments":{"__typename":"AttachmentConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[]},"tags":{"__typename":"TagConnection","pageInfo":{"__typename":"PageInfo","hasNextPage":false,"endCursor":null,"hasPreviousPage":false,"startCursor":null},"edges":[{"__typename":"TagEdge","cursor":"MjUuNHwyLjF8b3wxMHxfTlZffDE","node":{"__typename":"Tag","id":"tag:windows","text":"windows","time":"2025-01-27T11:33:36.807-08:00","lastActivityTime":null,"messagesCount":null,"followersCount":null}}]},"timeToRead":1,"currentRevision":{"__ref":"Revision:revision:143839_1"},"latestVersion":null,"metrics":{"__typename":"MessageMetrics","views":707},"read":false,"visibilityScope":"PUBLIC","canonicalUrl":null,"seoTitle":null,"seoDescription":null,"isEscalated":null,"placeholder":false,"originalMessageForPlaceholder":null,"messagePolicies":{"__typename":"MessagePolicies","canModerateSpamMessage":{"__typename":"PolicyResult","failureReason":{"__typename":"FailureReason","message":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","key":"error.lithium.policies.feature.moderation_spam.action.moderate_entity.allowed.accessDenied","args":[]}}},"archivalData":null,"customFields":[{"__typename":"CustomStringField","name":"smartconx_source_identifier","stringValue":""},{"__typename":"CustomStringField","name":"smartconx_message_origin","stringValue":""},{"__typename":"CustomStringField","name":"smartconx_share_messages","stringValue":""}],"body":"

1Password is using different meters for the Password Generator versus once they're made, which is confusing and annoying as I want all my passwords to be Fantastic as long as the site supports it. Please use the same meter for the generator that you're already using once they're made. I have the same issue on the Windows desktop app and Android. The strength meter is important to help users provide stronger passwords, as discussed in https://1password.community/discussion/19507/understanding-password-strength-meters and in https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/publication/does-my-password-go-up-to-eleven-the-impact-of-password-meters-on-password-selection/

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You can see here the strength meter is full green. I tested increasing characters to 100, and the strength bar stayed full green, no change.
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However after the credential has been saved, 1Password tells me it's only Good, not Fantastic.
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\n\n

I'm confused why you have two different rating system UIs in the first place. Imo the generator should show exactly the same info as it'll show once saved, maybe like this:
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\n\n
\n\n

1Password Version: 8.8.0 / 8.9.2
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"},"Conversation:conversation:143839":{"__typename":"Conversation","id":"conversation:143839","solved":false,"topic":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:143839"},"lastPostingActivityTime":"2023-01-09T06:35:21.000-08:00","lastPostTime":"2023-01-09T06:35:21.000-08:00","unreadReplyCount":17,"isSubscribed":false},"ModerationData:moderation_data:143839":{"__typename":"ModerationData","id":"moderation_data:143839","status":"APPROVED","rejectReason":null,"isReportedAbuse":false,"rejectUser":null,"rejectTime":null,"rejectActorType":null},"AssociatedImage:{\"url\":\"https://www.1password.community/t5/s/cuxzj43862/images/bS0xNDM4MzktNjk0M2kyNkY3ODlFNDQ2Q0IzMzM3?revision=1\"}":{"__typename":"AssociatedImage","url":"https://www.1password.community/t5/s/cuxzj43862/images/bS0xNDM4MzktNjk0M2kyNkY3ODlFNDQ2Q0IzMzM3?revision=1","title":"8gqo0zdxp5gm.png","associationType":"BODY","width":302,"height":243,"altText":null},"AssociatedImage:{\"url\":\"https://www.1password.community/t5/s/cuxzj43862/images/bS0xNDM4MzktNjk0NGlCMzg2MUE3NDBDREFCMDA0?revision=1\"}":{"__typename":"AssociatedImage","url":"https://www.1password.community/t5/s/cuxzj43862/images/bS0xNDM4MzktNjk0NGlCMzg2MUE3NDBDREFCMDA0?revision=1","title":"rs84t0elxn3u.png","associationType":"BODY","width":465,"height":159,"altText":null},"AssociatedImage:{\"url\":\"https://www.1password.community/t5/s/cuxzj43862/images/bS0xNDM4MzktNjk0MWkyODIwQ0RBMjEwNzlDMEM4?revision=1\"}":{"__typename":"AssociatedImage","url":"https://www.1password.community/t5/s/cuxzj43862/images/bS0xNDM4MzktNjk0MWkyODIwQ0RBMjEwNzlDMEM4?revision=1","title":"b74rhv5ub0op.png","associationType":"BODY","width":302,"height":243,"altText":null},"Revision:revision:143839_1":{"__typename":"Revision","id":"revision:143839_1","lastEditTime":"2022-08-27T08:40:21.000-07:00"},"ForumReplyMessage:message:143854":{"__typename":"ForumReplyMessage","id":"message:143854","conversation":{"__ref":"Conversation:conversation:143839"},"author":{"__ref":"User:user:-1"},"entityType":"FORUM_REPLY","eventPath":"category:discuss/community:cuxzj43862board:1password/message:143839/message:143854","revisionNum":1,"uid":143854,"depth":1,"hasGivenKudo":false,"subscribed":false,"board":{"__ref":"Forum:board:1password"},"subject":"Re: 1P8 Password Generator Strength Good versus Fantastic","readOnly":false,"editFrozen":false,"showMoveIndicator":false,"moderationData":{"__ref":"ModerationData:moderation_data:143854"},"parent":{"__ref":"ForumTopicMessage:message:143839"},"body":"

@BobArch2 Storing your credentials in a spreadsheed \"for reference\" is horrible from a security point of view. And it's tedious, probably unneccessary work. It seems you don't actually trust a password manager to keep your credentials safe.

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The reference I posted tells about the rating of a password directly created inline in the password field of the 1Password app. Not a password that was generated inline, copied somewhere, and pasted back. The moment you paste a password into the password field (or edit the password) the password loses its property of being \"generated from true random charactes\" to \"unknown, if generated from random characters\", because pasting a password doesn't copy this informating along, and this is what the rating lowers.

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If you paste a password, the rating function doesn't know if the pasted password was once created using true randomness, so it cannot give the best rating. If you create the password inline with the integrated generator and directly save this created password, the rating function knows that the integrated generator was used to create this password, the generator uses true randomness, and this is what it enables the function to give a better rating.

","body@stringLength":"1231","rawBody":"

@BobArch2 Storing your credentials in a spreadsheed \"for reference\" is horrible from a security point of view. And it's tedious, probably unneccessary work. It seems you don't actually trust a password manager to keep your credentials safe.

\n\n

The reference I posted tells about the rating of a password directly created inline in the password field of the 1Password app. Not a password that was generated inline, copied somewhere, and pasted back. The moment you paste a password into the password field (or edit the password) the password loses its property of being \"generated from true random charactes\" to \"unknown, if generated from random characters\", because pasting a password doesn't copy this informating along, and this is what the rating lowers.

\n\n

If you paste a password, the rating function doesn't know if the pasted password was once created using true randomness, so it cannot give the best rating. If you create the password inline with the integrated generator and directly save this created password, the rating function knows that the integrated generator was used to create this password, the generator uses true randomness, and this is what it enables the function to give a better rating.

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